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Warhaven Rap Battle!

You guys know Jackbox pack?

It's basically a collection of mini games but one of them has caught my eyes-- A rap mini game, Basically you form your rhymes and battle your opponent, other people( participating or observing) can vote for who they think had won the rap battle between the two and the winner gets the money.

It's pretty straightforward but hella fun, And that is why I decided to create this thread, to bring more interest to this fun mini game, but how can everyone see the rap battles themselves? That's simple, I've asked Kirisame if he could stream it as well as play it, and he agreed, that also mean he will host the game and you will have to watch it through his stream, but that's not a problem, you can still vote for who you want, it's just that the password in order to participate will be given in Kirisame's Stream so you better hop in!

To get the idea of the gameplay -- >

Tommykay's video also inspired me to do this, but enjoy the video its pretty funny.

I want to know how many would be interested in joining, write your name here so I can form a list but also this isn't just Warhaven as community, it will be open for anyone who wants to participate, the more the merrier and may the best rapper win! I will form a date that fits most people in the upcoming days.

-Kirisame (Our Host)

A few ideas

Hello everyone,

Having played this map for years now, I would like to share some of my thoughts about it with you. I am mainly playing Shadow Council, Ranger Corps and Highborne, but have also played other factions occasionally as well, so I can say I saw the map from different in-game perspectives.

General Observations:
  1. Techtree-expanding upgrades - these upgrades are mostly dependent on game time elapsed or other such upgrades, which is quite dull as it only requires you to wait for x minutes to pass.
  2. Civil War - unless UD and Legion teams have been working really closely or Legion team sharing land border with UD team, them splitting up wont hurt them in the slightest. To the contrary, it would buff them, since Civil War unlocks a vast amount of content for several Evil factions. Another problem is no Civil War happening at all which leads to UD tping south/Green and Brown going north to fight alongside Grey/Legion going north to help UD team.
  3. Extreme tankyness of late game melee units, elites and heroes (mostly melee) - This is a problem if you have to chase a cp sniping hero squad or a ninja Arthas going on a sneaky Frostmourne-grabbing trip to Northrend, or fight late game hero squads who can kill entire armies on their own.
  4. Many units and heroes having quite small collision sizes - It is often hard to effectively surround units and heroes during unorderly retreats of enemy armies. One can imagine how frustrating is to see a huge, lumbering Magtheridon moving through tight gaps with no problem.
  5. Ease of spamming air units - certain factions start with op air units (looking at you brown). Undead air units are the real problem here as you can have a combined UD team air army numbering dozens of various air units.
  6. Ease of stacking numerous buffs on your units - combined with high hp and armor, this makes fighting previously mentioned hero squads of certain factions quite obnoxious.
  7. Ease of teleportation, moving through worlds and base aiming - this is especially a problem for factions with parts of their techtree being dependent on certain bases. You can quite regularly see UD team ninja entering Mardum with Naxxaramas, or Sylvanas and Vereesa casually entering Mardum to take the OP bow and teleport away with troll faces before you can even notice them. Not to mention teleporting on Shades, Eyes of Archimonde, etc.
  8. Ease of tower spamming - not much explanation needed here I recon.
  9. Navies having little relevance - the only type of ships you really need are transports, which are too fast to be taken out by small/medium sized fleets without some form of slowing them down.
  10. Shalandris Isle - it is nothing more than a free gold bank, even though the island is a barren piece of dirt with no real use. No to mention that you can take it without even landing on it.
  11. Mana Flare - it doesn't really seem to do that much with so many aoe healing spells and items available.



  1. Making some of these upgrades dependent on player actions/achievements. Some examples:
    1. Teal getting Infernals/Pit Lords/Doom Guards when his team destroys Ironforge, Dalaran, Capital. Quel'Thalas, Frozen Throne, etc. Kazzak could be made available after at least one of them is destroyed and Civil War happens.
    2. Smolderthorn trolls upgrade is available only after either Aerie Peak or Ironforge is available. It makes no sense for Voone and his tribesmen to join the Dark Horde without Rend and his bois proving they mean business.
  2. Civil War needs to happen automatically if certain criteria is met. This could include the destruction of certain capitals, Teal getting Book of Medivh or the Sunwell, Alliance losing 2+ players etc. In short, the system needs to assure that Evil team splits as soon as they make enough progress in their conquest of Azeroth.
  3. HP regen buffs, health, heals and armor need to be small enough to prevent late game fights from turning into hero squad brawls. Armies need to be necessary in order to win, as I don't think this was meant to be a hero defense map.
  4. The bigger the unit the bigger its collision size should be. Collision sizes in general need to be big enough to allow surrounds of retreating enemies, ninjas and cp sniping hero squads and units.
  5. Starting air units should be few in numbers or not at all present (strong ones especially). Food cost could be increased to 2 for stronger types of air units like Nether Dragons, Frost Wyrms, Brown's/THC dragons, OJ's Black Drakes, etc. Weaker types could be limited to 6 like OJ's Black Dragon Whelps are in case of multiple air units being available to the player and/or his team (UD team for example). Air units should all have light/unarmored/summoned armor type, with Dragon Scales type of upgrade being available if it makes sense.
  6. This could be solved by making a plethora of buffs (especially auto-cast and aoe ones) faction specific. A good example of this is Anasterian's E ability, which only applies to Highborne units (might be RC's as well but im not sure).
  7. Scrolls of teleportation should only be able to target Town Hall type of buildings, and certain special buildings like Keep Towers, Lordaeron Bastions, etc. It would also be able to target only fully built structures, in case that is not too performance-heavy to implement.
    1. (6. part two) The two portals to Mardum could be closed by Teal, as long as he controls at least one of the portals. The portals' defenses would be strengthened by adding unit production buildings near them and making the area around them favorable for defense. This would end the days of trivial and unopposed entering of Mardum. The way to teleport into Mardum would be by using scrolls of teleportation or Dreadlord, Teron Gorefiend and Shadow Council's elites' tp abilites. The shop item for opening portals should be available only after 30 minutes have passed (if that already isn't the case).
  8. Making towers either limited and/or have a food cost could improve the situation.
  9. Reduce the movement speed and, if needed, health of transports. This, combined with a few more island cps (Purgation Isle, Crestfall, Zul'Dare) would make naval dominance more important.
  10. Either make the cp invulnerable until some event happens or widen the island enough for battleships to not be able to hit the cp. Some relatively tough creeps could be put on it as well. Making ships unable to hit cps at all would be good in general.
  11. Either increasing the damage it does or making it also burn the target's mana could help.

Faction Specific:
  • Dalaran - never really seems to run out of mana. Dalaran city itself can be obnoxious to attack if the defender is a decent player, in part due to the two defensive crystals facing Hilsbrad being unattackable from afar, except by the attack ground command on siege weapons. Nerfing brilliance aura could help. Removing or nerfing Wise Council would make mana more scarce in general.
  • Highborne:
    • Dawnstrider Harbour could be given a multishot attack and/or starfall like the one that the Windrunner Spire has. the base itself could be expanded a bit and have more buildings in it, Spawning 3 frigates instead of 2 or a battleship and 2 frigates upon getting the base would be good as well. To balance this out the base itself would require a hero of a high enough level (6 - 8) to be spawned.
    • Wretched should only be available once Sunwell has been taken by enemies and 10-15 minutes to have passed since then to prevent UD team from getting free Sunwell.
  • Ranger Corps:
    • They should turn Forsaken only if Sylvanas is killed by a UD team faction and the Plague has been launched.
    • They are be forced into Forsaken if Quel'Thalas has been destroyed. Just like Antonidas dies once Dalaran falls, Sylvanas should die if Quel'Thalas is destroyed.
    • Vereesa and all elven lodges gained from the Silver Covenant upgrade are transferred to Silverhand/Argent Crusade/Alliance if Forsaken happen. If Scarlet Crusade/Onslaught are present they would go to Dalaran or Blood Elves/Highborne.
  • Blue:
    • All caster units should be limited to 10-12. Blue should only have a limited amount of casters since Grey is supposed to provide casters for UD team (or at least that is what makes sense to me).
    • Blue would have to accept Wretched into UD team, and if he does, all San'layn units are replaced with their original counterparts and those without them are removed. Valanar and En'kilah are transferred over to Wretched. Valanar would be unrevivable. It seems logical that the San'layn would be grouped up with their Wretched brethren if the latter joined the Lich King. It would also make Blood Elf players think twice before attempting to hop onto the UD train of doom in hopes of easy victory.
    • Sapphiron should either only be summonable by Arthas, or be transferred to Dark Green if he becomes the Scourge. He is Arthases personal pet after all.
    • A general problem with Blue is that he spends the first 10-15 minutes creeping the majority of Northrend unopposed, which he can do even with half of his starting units (been there done that). The player can thus focus on getting 6/6 upgrades and proceed to stomp his enemies with the help of Grey. To solve this I propose something in the lines of:
      • Azjol-Nerub can be gained only by capturing its citadel. Elder Nadox will no longer drop to ~10% of his health upon being approached by Blue. This would give Blue an actual challenge during his early game. Currently you can send 4 Gargoyles and kill Nadox while you creep Ulduar.
      • Storm Giants are laughable at the moment. They should be given spell resistance and some aoe ability (Thunder Clap, Chain Lightning, etc). Cleaving attack would make sense as they are huge.
      • Sapphiron should be buffed up and be surrounded with Blue Dragons/Drakes/Whelps. He is rather tough in the Frozen Throne campaign and that should be reflected in this map.
      • Zul'Drak should be tougher to take too, as Grey can easily take it with his starting units in Northrend. Buffing up the towers/adding splash damage towers and adding a few more strong troll units would do it.
      • Bounty would have to be readjusted due to the increased number of creeps.
    • Nerubian Web Spinners (the ones with Blink and Web) should replace Crypt Fiends and Aqir Sentinels should replace Gargoyles. The former are a buffed up version of Crypt fiends and there is no reason to have two versions of the same units available. Currently Blue has access to 3 air unit types (Sky Barges not included) and replacing Gargoyles with Aqir Sentinels would reduce this count to 2 (they are also stronger than Gargs).
    • Summoned Nerubian Guards should have timed life. Currently Anub'Arak can summon endless swarms of these walking tanks. Another solution is to make his ulti spawn other Nerubian units instead.
    • Blue should start with 550 gold, so that he is left with 250 after picking his first hero. This way he would have the same amount of gold at start as other factions do (everyone else starts with 250 if I remember well).
    • Civil War should automatically get triggered if Capital/Dalaran/Quel'Thalas fall. If evil team managed to destroy either of them, id say they have the upper hand and should split to let other factions stand a chance.
  • Grey:
    • Kel'Thuzad's escape to Northrend spell (or item, I don't remember) should not make him invulnerable and should have a 5-7 second casting time. After all, his death seems to have been a part of Lich King's plan all along. Personally I would remove it completely, but many would likely disagree.
    • Naxxaramas should only be summonable by lich-form Kel'Thuzad, or at least require the Plague to be unleashed and Kel to be level 10. It makes no sense for Naxxaramas to be summoned 3 minutes into the game by picking Deathknell and sending Kel on a quick boat trip to Northrend.
    • Lady Deathwhisper should only be available either after Naxxaramas has been summoned or Capital City taken. This is part of making upgrades not depend on elapsed game time alone.
  • Forsaken:
    • Should have a barebones techtree while under Lich King's control. None of their lore-related events and upgrades should be available. This will both nerf UD team and make Forsaken players want to betray UD team in order to achieve their full potential. It also makes no sense for mind-controlled Forsaken to develop a religion of their own.
    • Should be able to free themselves from the Lich King if either of the following happens:
      • Weakened Lich King
      • Level 10 Sylvanas and 15 minutes since they became Forsaken.
      • Frozen Throne destroyed - automatically freed.
    • They would join the Neutral Renegades team or Horde team (if added to the map).
  • Orange:
    • They are oftentimes the last faction to be picked in the lobby due to, in my opinion, lacking paths (especially a second chance one) and lacking any real flavor. They even lost their op dragons to brown, which should be reversed honestly. A few days ago a player in the lobby I joined called Orange something in the lines of "slow and stupid" before leaving, as that was the only faction left to take.
    • Two new paths could be added:
      • Solo Maggy path - Maggy steps forth from his citadel declaring himself the sole ruler of Outland. This is basically the Orange from the start of LTA and can do the same as in LTA - capture the portals to Mardum or become the Illidari (Illidari would be still be possible even without going solo Maggy). Brown would be able to join him if he went Black Dragonflight path the same way Blood Elves can join the Illidari, which would give him control of Blackrock Spire and Rend Blackhand. Allying with Brown and going Illidari are mutually exclusive. Going Smolderthorn could make this path unavailable, thus tying Orange to Legion team.
      • Horde path - pretty much the same as the Horde faction in LTA. Would be in a Separate Horde team with Forsaken and Blood Elves being able to join him. Freed Forsaken could even start in this team by default.
  • Brown:
    • Should get his Black Dragons back or start with just a single Proto Drake (or none at all).
    • I remember that there was a spawnable Ogre base for Brown in LTA in what is the Farstrider Lodge area in LTF. This base could be spawned by Brown upon destroying the Farstrider Lodge.
    • Gruul's Ogres are now available once all Ogre Strongholds are under Brown's control. This upgrade would tie Brown to Legion team.
    • Gruul's Ogres become more of a techtree upgrade rather than a complete techtree overhaul - Raiders get replaced by Ogres, Ogre Magi become available, Drummers replace Kodos.
  • Legion:
    • As mentioned before, he should get Infernals, Pit Lords and Doom Guards and Kazaak upon his team taking/destroying certain capitals.
    • Could get a seconds chance Troll path. Trolls would be as the ones in LTA and would start in Horde team.
    • Could establish a small base at Purgation Isle and enthrall Kormok to join the Shadow Council (if the isle is added). A Shipyard and a Temple of the Damned for Shadow Council wouldn't hurt either.
    • Would start with a small base in Northrend. This would allow Teal to both help UD in the early game and fight Yellow in the south. Currently Mal'Ganis just gets tped away without second thoughts.
  • Dark Green:
    • Upon either Capital or Strathholme having been taken by UD team, Northrend Expedition would automatically happen, as Arthas would be pretty damn pissed and irrational if that happened (as he was in the lore after Stratholme was purged).
    • Once both Capital and Stratholme fall, Arthas goes mad and disappears, giving the player the choice to go Garithos path or automatically become the Scourge after a few minutes. If he choses Garithos, Blue gets Arthas.
    • Kul Tiras area could get an update. The northern shore is pretty much defenseless due to its wide beach. The Temple of Hydromancy (or whatever) could be moved back north (once it's redesigned) or to the harbor.
    • Would no longer start with Stromgarde and Galen. The research to get them would have similar requirements like Kul Tiras has.
  • Illidari:
    • Should no longer be in the Neutral Renegades team, but in a separate Illidari team together with his Blood Elven allies.
    • Should be able to do Illidan's spell from the Frozen Throne campaign. Would have a 3 minutes timer and could only be cast at a few locations on the map (Dalaran, Sun Well, Capital, etc).
    • The spell would weaken the Lich King (becomes vulnerable, loses all mana, etc. Lasts for x minutes), reduce the level of all undead heroes by one and perhaps kill 10 random units of each Undead player.
    • If given the mission to destroy the Frozen Throne, the Illidari team would be neutral to the Legion team (no vision shared, but cant attack eachother).

Thank you for reading this incredibly long post,

Governments power and citizens freedom

Hello to everyone who comes here and wants to read this.
I made this thread because I came a video by (
, well not precisely this one but it's about the same topic ) and thought to myself that this is probably a very drastic and extreme 'solution' on how to lowering killing acts, drug deals and etc. ( criminal rates and acts in general)
Not only does this lowers the freedom on what people could do very much but it shows that the government wants to have absolute power over the citizens. It's not only very disturbing and frightening with what the government can do nowadays to oneself but to groups in general. With that I mean they can control and manipulate the citizens and making sure that there will always be this kind of governemnt and not one where the citizens have actual freedom.
I would ask to anyone reading this ,regardless of political orientation , if you would be fine if the government has absolute power and robs the citizens freedoms. And if you have a different solution onto how to ensure that the citizens are protected and can maintain their freedom which did not commit a crime.

Also, I would appreciate it if there are any mistakes I made in this thread so I can correct them.

With this I will enjoy anyone posting in this thread and bring forth any new solutions or thoughts you have in mind.